By Brian Wise.
Revered Canadian singer songwriter Ron Sexsmith is on tour in Australia now with his terrific recent album under his belt.
Call it serendipity but when I had to change my return flight out of Nashville last September it also meant that I was able to not only see Steve Earle inducted into the Grand Ole Opry by Emmylou Harris but I also caught up with Ron Sexsmith to talk about his superb new album, Hangover Terrace – and see him perform a showcase solo set at the City Winery. It turned out to be an unexpectedly brilliant move on my part.
After a ten-hour drive from Virginia, Ron met me at the Hotel Russell which has a podcast recording studio on his way to soundcheck. A few hours later he was on stage for an early gig, delivering a riveting 28-song set in 100 minutes with many selections from the new album. The next morning he was on his way to Georgia via Lebanon, Tennessee (the subject of one of his songs) and off for more dates on the USA tour which runs through November. Then, after a few more US dates in December, it is off to Europe on his way to Australia in April. What a trooper!
It’s a decade since Sexsmith was last in Australia, so he has another four albums to add to the repertoire and a whole lot more stories. When he arrives at The Russell he looks no older than he did last time we met, which must have been on his last tour here, and it is hard to believe that he is now 61. Though the passage of time has done almost nothing to alter Sexsmith’s boyish appearance it does seem to have blurred our memories.
“Well, I’m scratching my head,” says Ron when I ask him when we last met up. “I remember meeting you for coffee in Toronto once.” In fact, that was in 2012 when we actually met by chance at a Starbucks when we were both out searching for the release of the Bob Dylan Gaslight Tapes that was then only available at one of the coffee retailer’s stores. Our individual searches through numerous Starbucks stores inevitably had us rendezvousing accidentally at the only one that had any stock left.
But regardless of the hazy details we have been talking about Ron’s music since at least 1995 and his major label eponymous debut, produced by Mitchell Froom (a current member of Crowded House). It’s a contact inspired by the fact that I have also thought of Sexsmith as an exceptional songwriter who has also managed to carve out a sustainable career that has more people discovering his music with every release.
“I feel like what happened with my career is a different trajectory, “I guess you’d say I have a cult following. I can go anywhere in the world and fill a room and people seem to know my songs. But people walking down the street wouldn’t recognise me or would never have heard of me unless they’re music nerds like me or something like that. So, I’ve been very lucky to have that. In certain countries I do better than others. I do better than the UK than I do in my own country. For example, there’s people I know in Canada who are huge in Canada but can’t get arrested anywhere else. So, I just feel really lucky that I have an international career and I’ve been able to build it, and the audience seems to be quite devoted and interested in hearing whatever new thing I come out with.”
Since he was last here, Ron has also penned his first novel ‘Deer Life, A Fairy Tale’ and written a ‘yet to be released’ complete musical score for a stage version of the story. This year he also made his theatrical composer debut with the internationally renowned Stratford Festival production of As You Like It in Stratford, Ontario.
Sexsmith’s latest album, Hangover Terrace, is his 18th or 20th studio album – depending on whether you count his first two independently released recordings. Sexsmith has collaborated with the likes of Daniel Lanois, Mitchell Froom, Tchad Blake and Bob Rock but he is reunited with producer Martin Terefe for the new project. Recorded in London’s Eastcote Studio its guests include Ed Harcourt and legendary producer Chris Kimsey who dropped in on a session. (“Apparently he was a fan of mine,” says Ron of Kimsey’s appearance, “but I didn’t know this, but I happened to run into him and we were chatting, and next thing you know he is singing on one song.”)
Sexsmith’s songs have been recorded by artists such as Rod Stewart, k.d. lang, Nick Lowe, Emmylou Harris and Feist, and Hangover Terrace contains all the familiar elements that have endeared him to us for decades. There are the gorgeous and occasionally Beatle-esque ballads (‘Outside Looking In’, ‘Angel On My Shoulder’, ‘Must Be Something Wrong With Her’) plus the Ray Davies-inflected ‘Cigarette and Cocktail’. There are the lilting folk-pop songs such as ‘Don’t Lose Sight’ (which might be the best song Paul McCartney didn’t write and record this year), ‘Rose Town’ and ‘Burgoyne Woods’. Then there is the ever-yearning voice that always seems to be underpinned by melancholy while the snapshots of Ron’s life sometimes make you want to give him a hug and say, ‘It’s going to be okay’.
While the lyrics on this album are as personal as ever, they are perhaps now tinged with a slight political bent (‘Camelot Towers’) as well as a definite touch of uncharacteristic anger and defiance on the song ‘Damn Well Please’.
When we meet to talk about the latest album, I wanted to ask Ron about his songwriting influences and who he listens to these days.
Who are the people that Ron’s Sexsmith listens to?
Well, I’m old, right? So, I’m pretty set in my ways. There’s certain people that I always go to. I’m a big fan of Warren Zevon and especially during the pandemic. He was the only one I wanted to listen to: his sense of humor and whatever is his point of view. It made me feel heroic listening to him. I started listening to The Who again a lot during the pandemic because that brought back that they were my favourite band when I was a teenager, with The Kinks. So, those are the people I like to listen to.
What about new artists?
I’m really bad that way. I’m sure after this interview I’ll think of a whole bunch that I like to listen to, but I don’t really keep up. I have a friend who brings his computer over sometimes and he plays me some new things, and it always sounds interesting to me. But I mostly listen to older things, older songwriters. I still love listening to Randy Newman and Gordon Lightfoot. I don’t go looking for things. Sometimes I’ll hear something that’ll stop me in my tracks and I’ll go, ‘Oh, that’s really good’. But after this interview I’m sure I’ll think of about 10 or 12 people, current artists.
If I asked you about your top five albums of all time would there be a couple that would spring to mind immediately?
There’s certain albums that were really pivotal for me. Hearing Bob Dylan’s New Morning album, for example, that was the first one I bought. I didn’t know which one to buy. I remember looking through his little section at the record store …..and that one just had his face on the front and I just took a chance on it. So, that one’s always kind of remained still in my Top Five Dylan records, favourite Dylan albums. There’s a record by Warren Zevon, who I love. It was a self-titled album. It was actually a second record, but it was self-titled. I think that’s probably my favourite album of all time.
I love that album!
Just the production of it, the song cycle, all about the delusion of LA and all that stuff. I just find it fascinating. There’s an album that Ry Cooder did called I Flathead that’s risen in my estimation as one of my favourite albums of all time and that’s really sweet. It’s a concept album. I’m not quite sure what the story is exactly but it seems to be about a country songwriter who also was a race car driver, but it seems to be singing about an America that doesn’t really exist anymore. That’s very romantic and nostalgic. So, I love that album.
Off the top of my head, Good Old Boys by Randy Newman is one that changed my life. When I heard it, I was like, ‘Wow, I didn’t realise you were allowed to say that in song or have just come at you from those different angles’.
But nobody would pick from those that they would influence your lyrics. Is there a danger in songwriters listening to other songwriters are being influenced?
Well, I think, yes, you’re right. I don’t really come at it in the same way that Warren does or Ry Cooder. I think in terms of my song writing that the DNA in my music is very much, I think, Ray Davies. I think I hear him the most in terms of an influence on me melodically and the kind of things I sing about. Although, I think I go way more personal than Ray Davies. Ray is always observing from a distance. He doesn’t really give you too much of himself; whereas, let’s say John Lennon, everything was about himself. I kind of saw myself as a cross between those two – nowhere as good or anything but those people were the ones that made me want to be a songwriter.
It’s interesting to hear an acclaimed songwriter such as yourself talking about other songwriters. We can hear the sort of things you’re talking about – the personal lyrics – on the new album, which is Hangover Terrace. It’s your 18th studio album since 1986 or 20th, if you count the first two cassettes.
If you count the cassettes, which I don’t think anybody does but the cassettes were important for me to do. Definitely. In fact, the one cassette I did called Away in 1986 was the first time I ever got any notice from the record industry. I remember there was a guy at Island Records that was interested at the time. He was the one that said, ‘Hey, I can’t work with you if you don’t move to Toronto’. That got me and my family out of St. Catherine’s. But I can’t believe it. I always wanted a body of work and now I have a body of work.
It’s almost 40 years, isn’t it?
Yes, it’s crazy. I don’t think people really start counting until ‘95 when my debut album came out. Nobody really had heard of me before that. But I was already 30 when I got signed, so I really came in under the wire and was so grateful that. I don’t know where I’d be now if I hadn’t had that break. If Jimmy Iovine hadn’t signed me, maybe I’d still be a courier or something.
The new album is titled Hangover Terrace. At first, I thought it was Hanover Terrace. Tell us about the title.
Well, it was inspired by Hanover Terrace. My band and I were playing the London Palladium last year, which was kind of a pinch yourself moment. So, we’re all in this one of those big hackney cabs when we passed this building called Hanover Terrace. When you’re in a band everyone’s saying something stupid all the time, joking about this and that. My drummer just said as we passed that, ‘Hangover Terrace’. I had a title already. I was going to call my album Corduroy Phase based on this new corduroy jacket I bought that I was wearing everywhere. But when he said, ‘Hangover Terrace’, I thought that’s a much better title because I feel like this album lyrically has a feeling of this sort of hangover that everyone’s been experiencing since COVID and even in the Trump years and all that.
The new album is produced by Martin Terefe, again.
Although we haven’t worked together in a long time. The last time we worked together was 2007. But I had a big show in February of 2024 for my 60th birthday and so all these people from my past showed up. It was really nice. I didn’t know Martin was there but after the show he came up to me and it was like we were really excited to see each other again. That’s what happens when you run into an old producer. I just happened to have these songs. I was in talks with Bob Ezrin, actually, about doing this record. He’s Canadian, but we just had a different vision of how we thought it could go.
But as soon as I saw Martin, I thought, ‘Okay, I think it’s time we got in the studio again’. Because he did three of my previous ones and they’re among my favorite ones, like Retriever and Cobblestone Runway and Exit Strategy of the Soulwhich I was really proud of, even though it was not successful at all. I just feel Martin knows what to do with me. He knows how to update my sound and give it a contemporary kind of vibe. It’s just very free and spontaneous.
Martin has this thing – he’s got this stable of musicians just roaming around and he knows how to put it together. We are all in the studio looking at each other and we’re all bringing in our ideas. Some producers are more rigid. Martin likes to let things happen.
Robbie McIntosh was someone that I’ve always wanted to work with, who he was in the Pretenders and played with McCartney. I was reading an interview with him, and he happened to mention me in the interview and I just thought, ‘I wonder if he would be into coming down and playing on my record’. So, I just took a chance, sent him an email and he drove up one day and he played on four songs.
It’s a beautiful sound.
I have to credit Martin for that. Sometimes you make a record and you’re not always sure about what you’re hearing coming back through the speakers. You’re like, ‘I hope it’s okay’. You worry a lot making a record but not with this album. Everything I heard coming through the headphones and the speakers just sounded like a record to me. Everyone was playing so good. I was really happy with this particular batch of songs, and I think I was singing pretty good. So, I didn’t have any of that self-doubt that I normally get with records where I wish I would’ve sung that one better or this and that. Pretty surprisingly, I thought I was satisfied.
I saw Rodney Crowell perform at Third and Lindsley here on a great show. He’s got a new album too [Airline Highway] and it struck me when I was listening to the songs that there’s no reason why a songwriter shouldn’t get better as they aged. People think they drop off or whatever but really it’s a skill that you’d be constantly developing, isn’t it?
It always bothers me. Every artist has that sort of golden period, their first 3, 4, 5 albums, or whatever, and then they’re forever sort of attached to that. Nick Lowe said that sometimes when you play a show, the thing that frightens the audience the most is when you say, ‘I’m going to play some new songs’ and it shouldn’t be that way. The Stones will make a new album and then they’ll maybe play one song from it live. I get it because people paid big money. They may not have even heard the new album but I’ve never been that type of artist. I’ve never been that big. So, the people generally who are into me, they want to hear the newest things. And because every album for me is a chance to make a first impression, I put everything into every album as if it was my first.
I believe think I’ve gotten better at it. I learned so much from Mitchell Froom and other people about structure. I think I’m singing better than I used to, so I like to think I’m getting better. I don’t feel as presentable anymore. I mean, I’m 61 now. It’s harder to walk out on stage and feel like before.
I think Tom Waits……he’s always writing great songs. Most of my heroes, like Randy Newman, never stopped writing great songs. Warren Zevon on all his albums I love.
There are some that you think maybe, ‘What happened? Did they get lazy? Why was this person so great at this point and the rest of their career they ended up co-writing everything.’ It used to mean a lot to me to look on the back of an album and read ‘All songs written by Gordon Lightfoot.’ That’s what I do. I want people to know when they put that on an album. Those are my thoughts and that’s my music. Not that there’s anything wrong with co-writing or anything but it’s this thing that’s always meant a lot to me.
Well, Van Morrison’s new album is terrific. He sounds great.
The two songs I’ve heard sound great and he’s looking good too. I saw a picture of him recently with Jimmy Page of all people. I guess they’re old friends. There’s enough people out there who I love who inspired me, who are still out there doing it, and they’re still great. Maybe their voice has changed a bit, or maybe they look different, which is only natural. But I’ve always found it fascinating how artists age and how their voice changes, how their perspective changes. It’s perfectly valid. Like Gordon Lightfoot in his last bunch of albums, he didn’t sound like he did in ‘76, but I was interested in what he had to say and where he was at in his life, his point of view. So, I do try to get better at all these little things.
When you get to a certain age, maybe 60 in your case, do you reassess things look different?
I look back and since ‘94, all I’ve done really is tour, album, tour, album tour, and it was crazy. As a musician and especially in the ‘90s I had a family but that all fell apart because I was traveling around all the time and doing all the stupid things musicians are famous for. It felt like a decadence to it, just this lifestyle. I jumped right into it because as a kid reading Creem magazine, hearing all the stories and the debauchery and all that, and that appealed to me, that lifestyle. I wanted to have that, wanted to get on the road. But then I was sidetracked by having kids at a very early age and I was dad for a long time.
So, looking back over my career – I think most people’s life when they look back over their life – I hope they’ll have some regrets because you’ve never read a book or an autobiography where this person was nice to everyone and then they died. It’s a roller coaster of events, heartbreak and whatever it is. It may be not acting so chivalrous at times, but then realising, ‘Oh, that wasn’t cool. I got to make up for that’. I think this album is addressing a lot of that feeling.
There were just times where I think I was, my life was off the rails and I was never that famous, so nobody was really paying attention, but it’s true. So, I’m really grateful that I find myself now. We have this great life in Stratford, Ontario with some good friends. But it’s just acknowledging that this is where we are and looking around and see finding strength in whatever remains.
Hangover Terrace is available now. Ron Sexsmith is on tour now.
Thursday, 23 APR
MELBOURNE, AUS – Melbourne Recital Centre
Friday, 24 APR
Theatre Royal, CASTLEMAINE, AUS
Saturday, 25 APR
The Gov – ADELAIDE, AUS
Sunday,26 APR
Rosemount Hotel – PERTH